Curse

MrSlayer · Aug 09, 2007, 09:55 PM // 21:55

List of updates

Direct copy and paste

Quote:

* Ancestors' Rage: this Skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Anguish: decreased Energy cost to 10; decreased recharge time to 20 seconds; this Skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Defiant Was Xinrae: decreased Energy cost to 5; decreased recharge time to 5 seconds; increased duration to 5..15 seconds; this Skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Disenchantment: decreased Energy cost to 10; decreased recharge time to 20 seconds; this Skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Dissonance: decreased Energy cost to 10; decreased recharge time to 20 seconds; this Skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Gaze of Fury: decreased recharge time to 20 seconds.
* Recovery: fixed a bug that caused the effect to persist even after the Spirit had died.
* Sight Beyond Sight: decreased recharge time to 15 seconds.
* Spirit Burn: decreased recharge time to 6 seconds; decreased damage to 5..50 damage; decreased conditional damage to 10..40.
* Spirit Rift: increased casting time to 2 seconds.
* Splinter Weapon: decreased recharge time to 20 seconds.
* Vital Weapon: decreased duration to 5..35 seconds.
* Wanderlust: this skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Wielder's Strike: this skill now causes Exhaustion.
* Xinrae's Weapon: decreased Energy cost to 10; decreased recharge time to 10 seconds; this skill now causes Exhaustion.

How it will affect me;

No more Rt/R or R/Rt Tombs builds or Margonite Farming
No more Rt/W UW farming
No more Spirit Spammer builds on Razah
Decreased effectiveness of my ritualist Spirit Spammer PvE builds and channeling builds

My opinion? I might as well just put my ritualist up on the top shelf and leave her there.

Thanks to alot of intense use of Rit Spike teams in HA, it would appear that my ritualist is going to see almost no use in PvE. I'm not a PvP player and it's a HUGE shame that thanks to Anet's thinking of "Don't provide an improved way to fight this spike build, instead let's just hit it with the nerf bat" the Ritualist is going to be much less useful in PvE.

I used to run my rit as a Spirit Spammer alot due to it's usefulness in helping negate damage, especially in the later missions. Although in hard mode this wasn't AS useful because of the intense damage, it was fun for Normal Mode.

But now it looks like my rit will be left to run Restoration Healing builds, which are alright I guess, and Channeling builds, although a HUGE WTF about Ancestor's Rage.

I don't blame PvPers for these predicted changes, because tbh, there will ALWAYS be ways to spike. It's just a shame that Anet don't just reduce the spike power, or maybe boost Monks or other professions in a way to lessen the effects of the spikes in PvP. Instead they hit rits with the nerfiest of nerfs they can think of.

Anyway, enough of my bitching. I don't have any problems with PvP or PvE players liking what they do, I just want people's opinions on how these changes will affect your farming, mission/quest doing or PvPing.

Xiooua · Aug 09, 2007, 10:02 PM // 22:02

Well, rift, burn and wielder's are all on my channeling bar. Rift is still viable, a two second cast I can live with. Burn isn't as useful now. I'm just surprised by wielder's, I expected a damage reduction, not exhaustion.

Adding exhaustion to everything does not equal "balance".

I enjoy playing a restoration rit, but I really don't want that to be my only option.

Phantom Gun · Aug 09, 2007, 11:09 PM // 23:09

I think they need to go back to the drawing board and figure out a more reasonable solution.

For my Rt/N=

/Wave

Variety: "hmmm minion bomber or restoration? I wonder what else this profession has to offer. huh? Exhaustion? *Checks energy* /Sigh

For my R/Rt=

Me: Splinter Barrager LFG!

Random Person: LMAO Didn't they nerf you? Wow 2 shots at the most and you have to wait for 20 seconds. Sorry we'll take another ele, Noob. Can you go restore?

Me: /Sigh *Goes to find a nice spot to be burried*.

My rits in general=

Me: Please stop nerfing me ok?

Anet Employee: Would you like a coffin or should we put your ashes into an urn?

Random victim of a Ritspike: I know! I know! That's put his ashes in a urn and then drop him into a volcano!

Anet Employee: OMG I just got an idea for a new elite skill!

Some other victims of a Ritspike: Volcano! Yeah! LFR to a Volcano!!!

"Thus was born the Fellowship of the Urn.......and a new elite skill"

the Puppeteer · Aug 09, 2007, 11:41 PM // 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantom Gun

Me: Please stop nerfing me ok?
Anet Employee: Would you like a coffin or should we put your ashes into an urn?

Pretty well sums up the current state

VendingMachine · Aug 10, 2007, 12:24 AM // 00:24

Now this is why people say Ritualist should become Resto.

Quicksilver Switch-Blade · Aug 10, 2007, 12:46 AM // 00:46

My poor rit, and I was having so much fun with it.
Now all the really good attacking spirits, cause exhaustion, who cares that the recharge was improved (energy cost was not really improved, exhaustion takes away 10 so, it ends up costing you 20 energy, 10 of which take forever to get back).
Vital Weapon, the only weapon spell that lasted a reasonable amount of time that fulfilled the req of having a wep spell, SS won't be as fun for those who used little in communing.
The only thing good out of this update, was making the xinrae spells maybe a thought on using, but by no means viable due to exhaustion.

Sigh, I wont be on using my rit anywhere for a while

KicknDave · Aug 10, 2007, 12:53 AM // 00:53

To note...READ the updates before you cry.

"Splinter Weapon: decreased duration to 20 seconds."

Not recharge, but duration.

Also to note the exhaustion on spirits could be a bit extreme, I think in a sense having spawning power effect the level at which one is exhausted from a binding ritual would be good.

Phantom Gun · Aug 10, 2007, 12:57 AM // 00:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by KicknDave

To note...READ the updates before you cry.

"Splinter Weapon: decreased duration to 20 seconds."

Not recharge, but duration.

It said recharge at first. So most of us did read them. It's not our fault if they made a mistake.

MrSlayer · Aug 10, 2007, 01:36 AM // 01:36

Hurray on the Splinter Barrage.

Check my Original post...that was copy/pasted from Gaile's page...you can see the wrong typing there.

Guess I can still Rt/R in Tombs :]

Iñaki · Aug 10, 2007, 01:58 AM // 01:58

WTF was the point of this update? To nerf riftway, or to simply kill the ritualist for everybody who enjoyed PvE, or to give it no use whatsoever in the game? I guess everything I just mentioned (except maybe Rt/R). Thanks, Anet.

I MP I · Aug 10, 2007, 02:08 AM // 02:08

Hasn't had any affect on me. My pve rit is doing just fine.

I think in a few days people will have come up with some new builds. Stuff like this always happens with this game.

moriz · Aug 10, 2007, 02:25 AM // 02:25

let's face it, some of the rit's spiking skills were just ridiculous. i kinda like the exhaustion change. they're now similar to gale: use these at the right moment, and you can blow your opponents to pieces. use these indescriminately, you won't have any energy. if a mesmer or a warrior can run spammable exhaustion skills, i don't see how a rit can't.

nutsngum · Aug 10, 2007, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSlayer

How it will affect me;

No more Rt/R or R/Rt Tombs builds or Margonite Farming
No more Rt/W UW farming
No more Spirit Spammer builds on Razah
Decreased effectiveness of my ritualist Spirit Spammer PvE builds and channeling builds

Rt/R or R/Rt still works fine. Rt/W UW smite killing is barely changed by the addition of exhaustion, as the time in between groups is in the neighbourhood of 20-30s anyhow. Somehow I doubt spirit spammers relied on JUST the spirits that happened to get the addition of exhaustion. Shadowsong? Pain? Bloodsong? Defensive spirits? Yeah, easy there chicken little.

Shadowmere · Aug 10, 2007, 03:02 AM // 03:02

meh, my rit will survive

I feel bad for the Spirit Spammers though, their long recharge and easy nuking wasn't enough of a balance?

the only thing that directly affects me here is ancestors rage, no more using it as an emergency melee defense

MrSlayer · Aug 10, 2007, 03:02 AM // 03:02

You try casting a 2 second cast time spell without being interrupted by the grasps...

It was hard enough with a 1/4 second cast or 1 second cast, it's near impossible with a 2 second.

But yes as I stated Rt/R and R/Rt is the same...it was a typo on Gaile's part.

nutsngum · Aug 10, 2007, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSlayer

You try casting a 2 second cast time spell without being interrupted by the grasps...

It was hard enough with a 1/4 second cast or 1 second cast, it's near impossible with a 2 second.

But yes as I stated Rt/R and R/Rt is the same...it was a typo on Gaile's part.

Near impossible my foot. I've already completed 3 runs post nerf. Take 4 at a time, cast under gladiator's defense (obviously), and if they still get it, be prepared to use a second cruel was daoshen. The worst case I had was having a straggler which I was still able to wand to death.

Bargamer · Aug 10, 2007, 07:18 AM // 07:18

My minion bomber is feeling fiiiiine. GW:EN is gonna give it new life too, since Putrid Bile is replacing Death Nova. Unless, I find out GW:EN hands me my butt on a platter. ^^;

Sazgo · Aug 10, 2007, 09:42 AM // 09:42

Its pretty sad they do huge nerfs on already unwanted/useless pve classes because some people using rits as gimmicks in HA. Its hard enough right now to convince people to let you into any hardmode area, urghoz/the deep or even DoA. I had a arcane echo spiritrift build that made it capable of doing damage almost comparable to a elementalist and allowing me a spot but now +1 second cast time is jsut bullshit, also adding in the exhaustion i would rack up by using ancestors rage :/

They could atleast buff spawning power properly +2% duration on wep spell per rank is still a joke and so insignificant. I see more healing rits with necro primary than rit these days.

Since hard mode the spirit builds are total trash also. WIth 16 communing 15 spawning power- shelter and displacement last a awesome 2-3 seconds before dieing due to increased attack speeds on mobs.

And i see in GWEN they giving ele's pets when they already so dam good its ridiculous. We will just see people wanting the same classes or using sf/monk heroes in the new dungeons just like it is now. Need to roll a monk or ele to do anything in this game.

Abedeus · Aug 10, 2007, 11:00 AM // 11:00

Yay, how cool. I capped Wanderlust and they nerfed it. Same as Searing Flames Nuker, Spirit Bonders (in Factions times), Stoneflesh Tanks and few other builds... I dont get it - If you wanted to nerf super-spike builds, than okay... But dont you think that ritualists are ALREADY less popular in PvE teams than Assassins or Paragons? Next time make it so people will rather take a MESMER than a ritualists, kthxbye.
Oh well. Anyone found a nice build, that people will take to party? Post it fast, before they nerf it again.

Calen The Civl · Aug 10, 2007, 02:12 PM // 14:12

Exhaustion is not the way to go. A good ritualist can handle 25 energy spirits better than exhaustion on spirits. The ritualist has built in skills that allow them to manage the high costs while not having any at all to deal with exhaustion. The high energy costs just forced the ritualist to be more decisive where to place the spirits.

Let's face it, in pve spirits are extremely fragile and are the first targets because of their low AL and hp. Using a mechanism the ritualist is unable to deal with to provide a negative aspect is the wrong method for such fragility. Granted, in pvp exhaustion would simply remove those skills from play.

Spirit exhaustion is mainly a threat to those new to the ritualist class and to heroes. Using Mighty was Vorzun and Empowerment in combination with a few exhaustion based spirits on Razah or a new ritualist leads to self e-denial.

Exhaustion in the channeling line is even more a danger because the ritualist, again, is not equipped to handle it. While elementalist glyphs can ease the problem, it is more likely the ritualist will lose any type of playability in pvp. Ritspike, it goes to say, needed removed because it was overpowered. However, exhaustion is not the solution.

A better method would be to rework both spirits and channeling to a charge system. Spirits would not have duration or hp, but use charges. Channeling would use spirit charges to fuel the damage, thus removing spirit effectiveness and returning the ritualist to a battlefield movement controller. Spirits would become immune to all forms of non spiritual damage. Instead, skills like Spiritual Pain, Banish, et al. would remove charges from the spirits. It makes little sense be able to use an axe to "kill" a spirit.

An example of a counter skill that does generic damage as well:

Spiritual Pain : Target foe and nearby foes take 15...63 damage. For each spirit within earshot of the foe, each spirit loses 1 - 5 charges and foes take an additional 5 damage for each charge lost on each spirit.

Other skills would be needed of course.

A charge system would allow a new dynamic and strategy to the class. Spirits would have various charges associated with them. Spawning power would increases the charges. Spirit energy costs would have to be adjusted because of their new mechanics.

For example, Pain would have 8 charges (attacks) at 16 communing. 12 Spawning would increase the charges to 12 ( 1 charge gained for every 3 attribute levels in Spawning).

Channeling spells would drain charges to fuel the damage. For example:

Spirit Burn: one spirit loses 5-3 charges in order to do the conditional damage. If no spirits are within earshot,the foe takes 50 damage

Spirit Rift: one spirit loses 5-3 charges. If no spirits are within earshot, foes within the spell's area take 50 damage.

The ritualist will adapt, but will likely fall out of favor in both pve and pvp.

I give pvp just a few weeks before another overpowered gimmick build sweeps through them. Pvp has a flawed design that encourages such skill exploitation. A more standardized build system would help curb the problem.